I’m not trying to put words into your mouth. Likewise, there are many non-Catholics who call the Church the ‘whore of Babylon’. DJK: Abstinence and fasting however are to be observed on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday.” They are a great spiritual benefit to all who accept them. I’m not saying that their documents are falsehoods, or even that they are rewriting history– I don’t know all the details. 1. DJK, Not that it was a mortal sin..it was your way of showing respect for the reasson of the season. But Jesus never says anything about His Word being entirely committed to a book. Even the many websites that promote this video make the same claim! Why mention God himself? How the above examples do any of that is beyond me. How can you claim to be open to BOTH SIDES of the story when you have, in fact, ignored anything exonerating the Church on such matters? We agree. I haven’t studied the question of when before Ordinatio Sacerdotalis the all-male priesthood might have been infallibly taught. Remember what Abe Lincoln said: You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time. I don’t know all the details To eat only a little, for one day? Also, check out http://www.catholic.com, which is where Jimmy works and his archives on this blog. Again, the Church as oppressive card and if only some rebel could have set everyone straight. When did the magisterium decide to elevate the all-male priesthood teaching to infallible? Amen brother! (And yes, I did notice that you commented on faulty logic.). In addition, the borders of much of the Muslim world appear to be hotspots of religiously-motivated violence (ex: Sudan, Kashmir, China, Indonesia, India, Afghanistan, Turkey, Iraq, Spain, Ethiopia, Kenya, Waziristan, Pakistan, Israel, the Balkans, Chechnya, Egypt, Morocco, Lebanon, Syria, Iran, etc.) MJG: Me Jerky (anti-Catholic) Guy. It is unclear to me if the scarcasm and condemnation in your other post is directed at me, the author of the blog, or both. Forgive my excessive use of SHOULD, IF, COULD, etc. I’m getting really tired of the misrepresentations, accusations, and overall bs. The Church, as a human organization, has plenty of motive to absolve itself in the crimes committed in it’s name. obediance outweights revolt and chaos Apart from the fact that he has the guidance of the Holy Spirit for your sake, it is almost certain that he has done far more “homework” than you, and that he is far more capable of getting it right. Re-investigating history is only invalid if it puts an agenda ahead of reality. I am unaware of anything in the Bible that says once per week is the magic hell-avoiding frequency, as opposed to every day, every six days, every other week, once a month, etc. Did the article say this? You must keep up. The Church reserves competence in such matters to the Magisterium. Some Day I also use CAPS because I am sometimes too lazy to use italics. If that is your definition of slavery, then I must agree with you. Take her goofy ramblings with a grain of salt as you picture her sitting sans humana in her one room apartment with herself and her dogs and cats dressed up like 14th century nobility. DJK, It takes time. DJK: Twice now, however, things have settled down, people all around have okay let’s be civil about this. I suppose that was true as well! I’d argue that #2 is the EASIER choice since in addition to AVOIDING PERSECUTION by the WORLD from folks LIKE YOU, there are the CONVENIENCES that the SECULAR WORLD offers, such as contraception, abortion and the like. I certainly don’t approach this from the point of view that I am teaching you about the faith, I am offering you my understanding of what the Church teaches. If indentured servitude does not violate the natural law, and the definition of slavery I am working with includes indentured servitude, it is axiomatic that slavery does not necessarily violate the natural law. I have only answered questions, and perhaps stated my opinion based on what I know. Offer to Jesus a sincere, heartfelt, sacrifice by taking command of your appetites in His name. Perhaps you should call for an inquisition. If you were to inspect any earlier post on this thread from Mary Kay, bill912, as well as myself — not one of us assumed the ‘worst intention’ that you’ve ascribed; in fact, we were more than willing to help DJK. It doesn’t change. You say in your most recent post: Esquire There are also New Testament references, but I don’t remember them off the top of head, but Jimmy would know them. Please don’t put words in my mouth…you’re addressing me with the same arrogant tone that you address DJK with. We don’t goof on dogma, but teachings seem to fall by the wayside too often, especially when it’s convenient. Not only are there people LIKE YOU calling them ‘MINDLESS’ just because they faithfully CHOOSE to follow the Church and CHURCH TEACHING (as Christ had taught) rather than SURRENDER themselves to the SECULAR WORLD; but they also endure other forms of PERSECUTION because of their FAITH and the fact that they actually FOLLOW IT! I think we agree here. Yes, Yes or No, No. Friday Penance is a *discipline* of the Catholic Church, and violation of it is a sin *for a Catholic* because it is disobedience of a duly appointed authority in the Church — not because the violating action is evil in itself. Understood by whom? Bear them gracefully. If you still think there’s confusion, perhaps the problem lies in who you’re choosing to give credence to. Who should be questioned? You’re too afraid to ask a few tough questions because it’s easier to be a follower. Now, that’s just false. Esquire It takes GUTS to be a TRUE FOLLOWER OF CHRIST in this world; there’s NOTHING EASY about it. I’m trying to find the truth. Mary is our spiritual mother. Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger “It was not mortal man that revealed this to thee, but My Father in heaven.” So our Lord chose a monarchic church, to which He gave His Authority. Disobedience to proper authority – without good cause – is a sin in itself. As a faithful Catholic, (no, I’m not a troll posing as a Catholic), I feel an obligation to come back and state these historical facts to the small group of zealots on this site. That’s just it, DJK — you haven’t even given any consideration whatsoever to any of the evidence that has been provided (not just by the Catholic Church, I might add, but also from secular sources) which actually exonerates the Catholic Church on various issues. We interpret the Bible however we like? All in due time DJK. You are just flat mistaken to assert that if a teaching of the Church is not ex-cathedra, we may ignore it. And he did not have truly legitamate power. Even bill912, based on his comment above, seemed to have thought so. The ignorance comment was made in response to a single poster, and I don’t remember which one it was now. It talks about how faithful Catholics form a conscience. I’m glad we can talk again. I think you’re referring to my Mar 7, 2007 2:48:10 PM post where I refer to DJK’s “vagueness”. When, exactly, did Esau make this rash generalization? They might not with the holidays, so I looked up the entry at Catholic.com, specifically I apologize if I am rambling–it’s very late. Smoky Mountain Hiker, thank you from the bottom of my heart for the Catholic link. Of course, it’s also POSSIBLE that I’m wrong on this… The only thing that you know about me is that I ask a few questions about my Church, so don’t judge me. Keep in mind that I am discussing temporal matters only, so the Church has no infallible authority here. we cannot deny that Church leaders did some pretty bad things in the inquisitions in the name of the Church … You cannot totally dismiss the entire historical record because of one BBC documentary As I said, I haven’t seen the program, and I am interested in what it has to say. You really must have a big ego. As you mentioned: …we cannot substitute blind faith for reason. Human beings are meant to be integrated, whole persons, and faith in Christ is what makes that possible. You also fail to realize that Spain was NOT a Catholic nation before the Inquisitions—it’s leadership was Catholic. Thanks as always for your HONEST response! “Our Church deals exclusively in faith–the area that can not be proven or disproven.” Oh yeah, there was a COMMENT that I found in another BLOG where the POST-ER said that the THE CATHOLIC CHURCH WAS INVOLVED IN THE ASSASINATION OF ABRAHAM LINCOLN! That’s not a personal attack. This is why He specifically said, “it is finished.” John 19:30. Would it change anything about the faith, except that the bible may not be perfect? There are a couple of quotes I’d like to point out to some posters who constantly attack my position on the Church and the inquisitions: Thus, in the present circumstances, the Roman Pontiff, exercising his proper office of confirming the brethren (cf. Jesus did found this Church on Peter, however, the current structure was built only after Rome legalized Christianity. Again, wikipedia is not the most academic source, but it’s at least debated a nd reviewed. Esau Second problem. “Keep in mind that I am discussing temporal matters only, so the Church has no infallible authority here. I have been reading several papal documents that are related to the issue. I can tell that this is one that you’ll be wrestling with for a while. I’m not trying to speak to ill of the Church, because I love the Church and it’s teachings, but I must admit that the Church has the ability to be imperfect from time to time because it is run by imperfect people. You shout out such loud condemnations against those faithful Catholics who would put such blind faith in the Church and how that is so unacceptable and outrageous; yet, when one reveals that you do so likewise, such blind faith SUDDENLY becomes such an admirable trait! That’s the dilemma many of us have: what is really right and wrong any more. Note that it is not defined infallibly, as would be the case if there were an exercise of the extraordinary Magisterium. So, in your words: I hate to break it to you, but your story claiming that the Church wants to rewrite the history of the Inquisitions — wasn’t actually anywhere indicated both explicitly or even implicitly in this program! It just occurred to me that you might not have heard that before, that obedience bears fruit. Rome, from the offices of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, on the Feast of the Apostles SS. Q96. However, assume for a moment, for the sake of argument, that they really did find Jesus’ body, buried with his wife and child. 7) You STILL haven’t said anything about printing false things about me.
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